This interview explores the transformative power of love, the role of Wanderers in supporting humanity’s spiritual evolution, the importance of honoring free will, and how individuals can embody spiritual service in everyday life by aligning with love, practicing mindfulness, and overcoming fear.

Radio RMN

Carla interviewed by host Rayelan Allan 1

Welcome to Rumor Mill News. I’ve been the publisher of Rumor Mill News for 16 years now and I am very honored to have Carla Rueckert as my guest today. Carla is best known for The Law of One. I think all spiritual people have heard of The Law of One. She was a meditator with the group that Don Elkins started in early 1962. I’m sure Carla is going to tell us all about Don Elkins.

She became partners with Don in L/L Research in 1968, and if you have a computer in front of you, you can go to www.llresearch.org. Carla began channeling in 1974, and began assisting Don in his research in 1970 so she has over 40 active years in the spiritual community, and in being a channel. She has a lot of things to tell us, and I have a lot of questions to ask her. Carla, welcome to Radio RMN.

Thank you so much, Rayelan. It’s wonderful of you to ask me to be here. I’m thrilled.

Well, I’m thrilled to have you because I have heard so many things about you over the years, and I never knew how to get in touch with you. I’ve read a lot of your work on the internet, but I never found your home pages until Wynn Free put us in touch and I thank him for that. Your experience is quite extraordinary. I’ve read a lot of what you’ve done, and I’ve also watched a number of [your] videos. You’re talking to an audience that you’ve never talked to before and a lot of people don’t have any idea of who you are. So Carla Rueckert, who are you?

Well, to begin with I’m just a person like anybody else. I was born in 1943 – I was a war baby from the Second World War, and I didn’t know my dad until I was 2 ½ years old as he was off fighting the war. I lived with my mom and her mom, and then with my mother-in-law’s family, and when dad came home I can actually remember meeting him. It was really nice, he played a song for me in the bus station before we went home – it was “Daddy’s Little Girl,” it’s a great first memory of your father.

He was a jazz musician and my mom was a performer, and the poor guys got pregnant with me and became people that needed a day job. Dad became a chemical engineer and mother became a practicing licensed psychologist and ended her career giving testimony to the judge for whether or not people could testify or could stand trial. And so I come from a very intellectual family but at the same time a very artistic family.

It was a very busy family and I was pretty much left at home babysitting my brothers and so I was an outsider at school, and kind of came into my own when I got into college and everybody had grown up enough that my difference from them wasn’t so obvious. Since then I haven’t experienced many problems at all, but when I was a kid I was really an outsider yearning to be inside and not knowing how because I was simply and fundamentally different.

I was born thinking about infinity and I can remember lying there and trying to picture it like, okay, this is finity and then we go beyond that and that is infinity. And you know, little kids don’t think like that so I got called all kinds of names and I was cross-eyed and that didn’t help but an operation when I was 11 fixed that. But I felt cross-eyed in my soul for a long time after that because it’s very cruel what people can say to you.

So that’s how I grew up, and what really helped me out the most was when I died. I died when I was 13. In the 1950’s there was no help for people who had a kidney failure. You either made it or you didn’t. They have transplants now and dialysis, but they didn’t even have medication back then. I was in bed a lot, my kidneys failed twice. But the first time they failed I had a really unusual experience and it helped me so much – and people can just say, “Oh that’s ridiculous, you were dreaming it”, and people have said that to me but they could never shake my absolute surety that this happened to me.

And what happened was, I remember leaving my painful body and, with no change in consciousness, I was in a different world – all the colors were alive, the trees and the flowers talked to me. I told a rambling rose bush that it was beautiful and it wrapped itself around my arm and there were no thorns – you know how thorny rose bushes are. I was walking towards this temple and knew all my friends were there. And about half way there, I heard this voice. This voice was somewhat impatient, not happy with me and it said, “We don’t usually do this.” And I thought, oh dear. The voice said, “You have chosen an incarnation that is much too heavy with catalyst and you really probably need to rethink it and have two separate incarnations.”

Now [I know I am] telling this to a group of people who don’t believe in reincarnation, but all I can tell you is, this is what happened to me. I don’t ask you to believe it, I’m telling you that it changed my life. So I thought, “Well, what do you mean by that?” The voice said, “You choose service to do and you can do the service but it’s probably easier to do it in two separate lifetimes. So would you like to come back in another two lifetimes and get this done?”

I thought carefully about the horrible time I had as a child, and two more childhoods like that? No, I didn’t want that, so I said, “Well, I’ll go back and try to get it all done in this one.” And that helped me so much. Of course I came back immediately into the bed and into my body, into pain again with no change in consciousness. That’s the one thing about death that I can honestly say is, that there is nothing to fear. You survive. You are infinite. You are a citizen of eternity. When you die you are moving on to another experience. This one has ended. There is another one down the road.

And apparently you’re going to communicate and talk it all over with your Higher Self, Holy Spirit, whatever you like to call it, to decide what you’d like to plan in your next incarnation. And then you’ll come back. So it’s wonderful to know that death is not an end and I can certainly tell you from personal experience that it just doesn’t end at all.

So I came back and just went on to school and on to college, graduated in English

Literature. I had been working as a student in libraries for a while and got a beautiful job for a first job. I was 21 years old and the assistant to the librarian of an engineering library, which was how I met Don Elkins.

Don was a fantastic fellow. He was a professor of mechanical engineering and physics. He was also an early student of the paranormal. In fact, he created the phrase ‘paranormal’ and, talking with other people, they picked it up and made the term famous. But he was the first one to use it, I believe. At any rate, Don had been carefully studying everything he could get his hands on about the answers, the real answers, to why are we here, what’s going on. He was very, very keen. He was a man of immense intelligence with a very broad and deep mind

He found some material that suggested that you could get in touch with people from other realms by sitting in a group in meditation and bringing them in simply by the way you meditated. He decided to make that experiment happen. So he asked twelve members of his physics class if they would like to be part of this experiment, which I heard about from one of the people he asked to participate. I asked him if I could come too and he said yes. So in 1962 we started meditating together, and almost immediately there was people starting to get some phenomena happening to them. They were getting peculiar noises happening in their mouths. They were making clicks and funny noises.

And soon they were making words – and the words were wonderful. The words were those that tell us that we were all one, that we are all one in the Creator, and that what we need to do is to vibrate as the Creator vibrates in love because the creation is made of love.

I loved those messages. I did not want to become a channel and I didn’t. But twelve years later, as you can imagine, all of these engineers had gone on through school, gotten jobs scattered all over the country and Don’s experiment was about to become extinct. So Don asked me if I would try to learn channeling. And just because I loved him dearly, and because we were research partners, I said okay.

Well, imagine my surprise! After a slow start I discovered that I had a gift for it. Well – I had a gift for it but it was like a gift for playing chopsticks. And I wanted to become a concert pianist! So there was a lot for me to learn. I found there was nothing out there that was going to tell me how to make my art, my craft, better. Well, being a librarian, naturally, what did I do? I sat down and analyzed it. What was making my channeling better? What was making it worse?

I came up with some conclusions that really seemed very solid. I found that people either vibrate in love or they vibrate in fear. A question asked in love is a good question. A question asked in fear is going to pull the channeling vibration down so I’m no longer talking to the same source.

That’s amazing, I never knew that.

Yes. So I began refusing to take questions that felt to me like they were from fear or any specific questions. I wouldn’t take those either because I could just feel the downward pull on my vibratory level. The other thing I found out was my part of it. To channel, I had to tune to the highest and best that I possibly could. So through the years I developed a tuning process – I went through it before this radio show, because I wanted to give you my best and, of course, my best is not coming from me, it’s coming through me. So I tuned up and asked the Holy Spirit, I call her Holly, with my very own flame [of the Holy Spirit’s fire] as I didn’t want to be forever impersonal. I asked if it was okay to name her – I talk to her all the time – and she said yes, that’s fine.

We can all talk to our inner guides. It’s a matter of focusing – and I can tell you pretty much how to do that, but that’s making a long story even longer – so at any rate, through the years I became maybe slightly more competent as a channel.

In 1980 Jim McCarty joined Don and me as a third member of the research group and, apparently, that shot of energy he brought – Jim is a wonderfully powerful person and a deeply devoted spiritual seeker – was apparently what we needed to pull in a contact that said it came from Ra.

Well, I kind of recognized the name of Ra from Egyptian mythology, and as I recalled from my college courses, 2 that mythology system has Ra down as a god of war. I didn’t want anything to do with that. I was a cradle Episcopalian, I’m very religious by nature and so I challenged that spirit in the name of Jesus Christ and said if you want to talk to me you’re going to have to tell me that Jesus is love – this is what they say in the bible to do and I was just following protocol, and it’s worked for me just great because my beliefs are very deep.

So I challenged three times because I always want to make sure that I’m challenging well; one time you might just slip, two times maybe, but if you do it a third time you know good and well that you’re focused.

So three times that entity that called itself Ra said they would be glad to say that Jesus was Lord and so I said okay, and a conversation opened up which continued for four years. It’s the only channeling I’ve ever done in trance. All my other channeling –

and I have almost 1600 readings in other channeling – has been conscious channeling. This was completely trance, I didn’t know what was happening, I was asleep and then I would wake up and the thing would have happened. Don collected these sessions and that’s what produced The Law of One, Books I – IV. That’s normally called The Ra Material.

Of course I had been channeling before The Ra Material. I channeled after The Ra Material. But it was all conscious channeling which is somewhat different. Most people like either one or the other better. Some people, like Ra, are very intense, very dense, as you know from reading [the Ra sessions] and not all that easy to understand, because there’s a lot vocabulary you sort of have to get under your belt. Once you do that [it is easier to understand.]

It’s surprising, the range of people [who like the material]. You don’t have to be an intellectual to get this stuff. One of my friends never went beyond sixth grade. [It was] just a matter of not having the money and so forth and so on. [He] had to work to support his birth family. Then [he] worked to support his marriage family and never had a chance at any schooling. But he loved that book. Of course he had to read it very slowly and out loud, but he got it. I think it’s for some people, so if you’re listening to this maybe it’s fallen into your life for a reason – I don’t know. You might check it out and if it’s of help to you I would be thrilled… I really would. You already have our web site address and you can check it out just by looking for the Ra sessions that you can search for on the www.llresearch.org site.

So in very short, that’s my story. I’m a librarian, worked as a librarian for 6 years and loved it, and expected I would spend my entire life as a librarian. But Don came along and said he needed a research partner and told me what he wanted done. He wanted to write a novel and then he wanted me to do the research for a non-fiction book. We wrote both of those and we weren’t making a dent, or so we thought at the time. But through the years, very gradually, very solidly, [another] book [of ours] has seeped through several generations of seekers and is one of the classics in its field now.

What’s the name of [that book]?

The name of those original four books is The Law of One, Books I - IV. Now Don had edited out a lot of sensational material, and some material about us as well. He edited out material about us because he didn’t want people making a fuss over us. He wanted folks focused on the material. I’ve tried to maintain that on my watch, as he died in 1984, I’m very sorry to say. And that is when the Ra contact ended.

Well, that’s interesting. Now did Ra ever tell you what he or it or they are?

Yes, they described themselves as a social memory complex; in other words, a group of people whose thoughts were open to each other and whose spiritual goals were so similar that they could work as one being. They also described themselves as The Brothers and Sisters of Sorrow.

They had heard the call from sorrowful people on Earth who were seeking this love, this knowledge of being one with the Creator, this belonging, this not being isolated. They wanted to come to help us realize that we are all one, that we are one in love. And they hadn’t found anybody until they ran into our group. It was probably because of the length of time that all of us had spent in our spiritual seeking and how sincere we were that we were vibrating at a level which they were able to match. They said that the only reason they were able to talk through me was because of this vibratory coherence between us and them.

They were very generous with their information but of course they were very careful of free will, so their only way of communicating was with questions and answers. They would answer questions but they would not orate or proselytize or give sermons. So the whole Ra Material series is a series of questions and answers with Don being the questioner and Ra being the answerer.

I have never been able to imagine a more perfect questioner than Don. As a physicist and engineer he was steeped in the scientific method and wasn’t one bit interested in frills and pretty language and marshmallow fluff. He wanted to know what was going on. And he asked in very technical terms sometimes.

Of course I would have had to be in trance to answer that because as I had no experience in the scientific side of things at all. My folks encouraged me to focus on what I seemed to be more gifted at, which was the arts. So I slid through college with a minimum of non-artistic, non-literary stuff, and mostly philosophy and literature. I was the worst person possible to be answering questions like, “Can you please tell us precisely how the creation began?” or “Could you please tell me if this equation is correct, and if so, how?” But of course in trance they could work through me and I wasn’t in the way saying, “I don’t know that stuff.”

So that’s the nature of the conversation. It was a remarkable conversation and it lasted about 4 years, and ended with [Don’s] death. There are 106 sessions in The Law of One, and they are free for downloading on our site. Or you can purchase them. Amazon has them. Or you can order them through your book store. They are out there. Or you can find them to order at our site store at (store.bring4th.org)[https://store.bring4th.org]. So if you’re interested, please do [order them].

In addition to that, since I figured out that producing The Law of One was probably my first incarnational work, I thought, well, that’s done – so now I wonder what that second incarnation[al work] is? I realized Don had died but he asked me to do two things: he asked me to start a spiritual community and head it, and to make the work that we had produced globally available.

At the time I thought, well, how am I going to do that? But then came the Internet and there were volunteers that knew how to work the Internet, and these new social networking things. That’s why you haven’t heard about us until recently, because we just got social networking running for ourselves last year when one of our volunteers finally got us signed up. [She] knew how to do all that. I didn’t know how to do that, I’m a dinosaur. But I was all for it. And fortunately the people that are around the group now are all younger and hipper, and know more about what’s going on now and can communicate better with people that are younger. So we have lots and lots of younger people – every age really, there is no prejudice about age or anything with The Ra Material. You either love it or you look at it and it doesn’t do anything for you. I would never tell people that it doesn’t do anything for to try it again. [I would say,] “Move on as there’s a lot of stuff out there.” But for the people that respond to it, I’d say, “Oh thank you, I am so glad.”

I figure the second part of my incarnation[al work] had to do with living the Law of One while I was being head of the spiritual community, and nurturing our on-line presence, making sure that everything is available for free globally and the universal Web makes all that completely and beautifully possible.

I really see this [internet] as training wheels for fourth density. It’s not a social memory complex yet, we don’t remember each others’ memories. But it’s a social complex and I love [the internet]. I just think it’s so wonderful and I’m totally a fan.

So that sort of is it, I married Jim McCarty, our third research partner, in 1987. We’ll have our 25th wedding anniversary the 30th of this month! Jim and I have dedicated our lives to “working for Don”.

Does Don work with you from the other side?

Oh yes, I was not away from Don for more than about 3 days. The first time I saw him after he died was very surprising to me. He showed up under very intimate circumstances with Jim and me. I was lying there in front of the fire just glowing in the afterglow, and here came Don. He was laughing. He [had been] a very celibate, stern, monk-like person. We had not married because of his dislike of anything like that, which was almost tacky to him. But he just wanted and appreciated me. It was almost against his will but he had to have me. The funny thing was that I understood that and I gave up everything to support him and I just loved him without reservations.

So here he comes, this celibate, melancholy man and he’s laughing, and golden and radiant, and I say, “What are you laughing for?” and he says, “I can’t believe I gave all that great stuff up.” And that’s the first time I saw him after his death.

Then he started showing up when I called for the Holy Spirit. Now I call for the Holy Spirit very carefully when I’m tuning because I want a very balanced stance.

[PROGRAM BREAK]

[END OF BREAK]

Did Don come back to you after that, after that first appearance?

Yes. I was telling you how he did that before the break. When I tune before I challenge a spirit – I told you I learned some things all the time I was channeling. I would look at each session and think, well now what made it a good session or a bad session, and I discovered that the more I prayed and the more I tuned myself to the vibration of love, the better the channeling session would go and the better the connection that I had. One of the things that I did as I was tuning up was to ask for the Holy Spirit and to do that I was very careful to balance that. I would ask for the feminine and the masculine aspect of the Holy Spirit – and soon after [the time I saw Don when I was lying in front of the fireplace], I saw him coming out from the door to my left, [and his right], the door which the male aspect of the Holy Spirit comes through opened, and when I asked, well there he came. I can’t tell you what a wonderful time that it was. There he was, 6’ 5” in his regular khakis which were always too short for him like he was wading in a very high creek, and he was looking so happy. And I reached out my hand and could feel the roughness of the calluses on his hand – but this was only in spirit of course; this wasn’t happening in the physical.

And so he has been working with me from the other side ever since. Now I regularly get information from other people and it’s so nice. They will have seen him and he always come when someone is in great distress. And he’ll just be with them for a while and they’ll feel better and they’ll write and tell me about it one way or another. So he’s doing beautiful work from the other side, and it’s wonderful to see him every time that I channel. I look forward to the tuning process because I’ll get to do work with Don. So I have seen him.

Right now I am recovering from spinal fusion surgery – matter of fact, it’s my 2nd spinal fusion surgery in 2 years. I had my first 8 vertebrae in my neck fused in 2010, and then dog-gone if my lower side didn’t go out of wack and get all crazy and I was headed for the wheel-chair. So I had to have lumbar surgery to get some really careful work done there and that’s done really well but I’ve had trouble with infections – 9 different times I’ve had to go back and get an operation to remove [them]– it’s call de-breding, when they just scrape out the wound and start over. And finally they found something called a wound vac which is really a miracle worker – it was developed in the beginning for women who had had “C” sections, caesarean births. That’s a very difficult operation from which to recover. It’s no small thing to choose a C section. Don’t do it unless you have to.

But at any rate, they put that machine that has a negative pressure on it over the open wound. They don’t try to close the wound because it will get infected. So they leave it open and put on this negative vacuum, and it pulls out all the infection. It’s worked for me as my wound has started to close just the way the people who invented that machine intended for it to work. It’s taken a long time and I’ve learned a lot of lessons of patience and persistence.

But I needed that, as you don’t get lessons you don’t need. I’ve done a lot of inner work and have really found in the last two years this wonderful realization that for sure, the only thing I can do that is highest and best in my life is to be. If I can be essentially a person that is open to love and that lets love flow through her, then I am serving not only myself and my immediate family but also the planet because that lightens the vibration of the whole planet. We can all do that. We can be sick as a dog which I have been for a while, and it doesn’t matter as long as we are tuning ourselves to love and gratitude and counting our blessings.

I have found so much wisdom in the last couple of years and I’m so thankful for the time. I’ll be glad when I can get back to writing but, you know, this was a thing that had to happen for me, this was the next step. Hopefully, in my writing, when I get back to it, it will reflect a more mature spiritual vision.

I can’t imagine how it could be any more mature than it already is, but it will be amazing to see what you evolve into after this. We should have the, what I will call, the BBs or the “before-backs” and the “ABs” or the “after-backs” and see if there’s any difference, if you are right that you have come up a bit. I do believe that happens with spiritual people. I spent a year in bed with viral meningitis and it was at a time when there were no antivirals. They sent you home with pain pills and you either died or got well, and I died like you did.

Oh, tell the story.

Well, I practically did. I died and I went to school on the other side and they taught me how to release emotional trauma that is trapped in the body. And so I gave workshops called Activated Cellular Memory [Workshops] for about five years. And then I realized that the process was so easy that all I had to do was put it on CDs and say, “If you really want to do this, you do it yourself.” And it’s amazing – I don’t even have any of the CDs anymore, they’re just downloads. And if people want the downloads they can buy them – and I give them away at certain times… like if anybody wants to send me an email right now at and just put ACM in the first one, I’ll send you the download. So I sort of give them away every now and then like that.

But then I started wandering throughout the universe visiting different planets and things, and actually entered into the body of a deer person who was the wife of the head of the deer clan. We talked a long time about philosophy and mathematics and physics, civilizations and all of these things – and he told me that the deer people were on this planet learning. They were learning in their minds because they didn’t need hands to build anything and didn’t need to build anything or need anything because all their food was provided, it was a perfect temperature year round so all they did was study in their minds. They were telepathic and wrote great epics and did all of this. And who were these beings? They were the Greeks, the Greek philosophers, mathematicians, playwrights and the Greek healers.

The next thing that happened to me is I flew off wandering around, looking around at more planets and stayed on one that was blue and green, the most beautiful blue and green colors you’ve ever seen. And then I heard laughter, playfulness and happiness and you could tell there was so much love in the laughter – so I crept up to the edge of the canyon which was like our Grand Canyon but it was blue and emerald green… beautiful.

I looked down and there were two reptilian-type people that I had never seen on Earth until I interviewed a man who said that Alexander the Great’s tomb was in Illinois. And out of the Illinois tomb there were all sorts of artifacts that were pulled out, and one of the artifacts had the head of this reptilian on it – the head went back to the time of Alexander. So I have no idea and the man didn’t know what it was either, but that was the only time I ever saw that. I looked at the two reptilians below and they were playing and kissing each other, doing what young people in love do. I experienced the depth of their love and realized I have never experienced it in my life on Earth. I was so upset because I’d been to Earth and really wanted to be in love but never really had been, even though I was married, and so I said, “This is it. I’m going home to my dad, because my dad loves me.” And so I took off.

Suddenly there was somebody standing there, blocking my path, and the guy said, “Where are you going?” I said, “I’m going home. Get out of my way!”

And he said, “No you’re not. You’ve not even begun your work yet.”

And I said, “I’m not going back there.”

He turns me around and says, “Look at that.”

And I said, “Yes, you see all that brown stuff around it? You want me to go back to that dirty, awful, filthy planet?”

And he said, “Yes, that’s your job, to clean it up.” And then he said, “And by the way, that’s not pollution you’re looking at. Those are thought forms you’re looking at. And you’ve got to clean up the mental and spiritual aspects of Earth. We cannot allow it to infect the rest of the universe.” He’s got his hands on my shoulder and says, “What is your poor husband going to do when he wakes up next to your dead body?”

And at that, I was right back in bed with more energy than I’ve had in a year.

I have to interrupt you at this point, not to stop you but just to read something from The Ra Material that I think you’ll understand. In the very first time they talked to us, before Don asked a question and they was just saying “I am Ra and this is why we’re here,” they said, “Let us for a minute consider thought. What is it, my friends, to take thought? Took you then thought today? What thoughts did you think today? What thoughts were part of the original Thought today [… meaning love.] And in how many thoughts did the creation abide? Was love contained and service freely given?

“You’re not part of the material universe, you are part of a thought. You are dancing in a ballroom in which there is no material. You are dancing thoughts. You move your body, your mind and your spirit in somewhat eccentric patterns for you have not yet completely grasped the concept that you are part of the original Thought.” 3

Now back to you. You’ve awakened, you’re not dead. You’ve awakened next to your husband and what happened?

Well, for a couple of months, I was okay. And interestingly enough, my life had changed completely. I had been on the spiritual path. Now I decided I was going to be political. Where that came from I have no idea. I had no experience in politics.

You were an optimist.

Yes, I know, I was just an optimist. So this is like taking a kindergartner and putting him in as the head of a bank with no experience. But interestingly enough I became the treasurer of the local women’s democratic club and then I was elected as assistant editor of their newsletter, and then I became the media coordinator for the Gary Hart 1984 campaign. And as soon as that campaign was over, I came down with meningitis again and was right back in bed for another six months. At that time, it was so bad that I could not even move my hip from left to right. I couldn’t get up out of bed. My husband was literally feeding me through a straw and helping me up to go to the bathroom. It was unbelievable. I was fighting with God daily. Finally, God said, “You know, it takes two to make a war and you can’t surrender because you’re the only one fighting. How can you surrender to me if I’m not fighting you? I’m not trying to win this war, I’m not fighting.”

And I said, “Oh! That makes sense.”

And God said, “All you have to do is give up fighting me.”

And so I did and I said, “Oh, I like that! That makes sense. Let’s be friends.” That’s my God story.

I have visitations from Babaji – you know who Babaji is, don’t you? 4

Yes, of course. My friend, Barbara Brodsky, who channels Aaron, she also has seen him, not a lot, of course, but she is one of his students and he has appeared to her from beyond.

I have loved Yogananda and thought Yogananda was one of the wisest men on the planet. And so when Babaji came in, you know, he was only about 2 feet tall and sat cross-ways at the foot of my bed. He literally kept me in stitches telling me jokes, very spiritual jokes. I wish I could have remembered them. But when I got well I knew that I was supposed to be ordained as a priest in the ancient church of Antioch – I don’t know if you’ve heard of it but you may have heard of[Archbishop of the Free Church of Antioch, Malabar Rite] Warren Watters, the man who ordained me. He started out as a Theosophist and was in the tent the day that Krishnamurti told everyone, “Thank you for the honors you do me but you’ve chosen the wrong man.”

And of course all of those people who were there thought that he was Jesus, thought he was the messiah and here their messiah just said, “Hey guys, you chose the wrong person, I’m not him.”

And so they wandered around for about ten years before they founded the church of Antioch, which was founded by Thomas, although most people say it was founded by Peter. And then they were able to incorporate, through the teachings of Thomas, all of their teachings from theosophy and Alice Bailey and did so quite nicely.

Yes, I’ve read the gospel of Thomas and it really does seem to be much more copacetic with the Buddhist way, the Yogic way.

It is. Yes, he actually opened 20 churches in India. Its name means “the followers of Christ.” 5

So now what I really need to do is go to India and find his churches, and find out what he really was teaching because we just don’t have enough of Thomas here in this world. So I think that’s one of my lessons, one of the things that I have to do. But I want to get back to you and I have another question that came from a reader who wants to know, how did you know the Ra group was not Ra the God of War? How did you figure that out? And my [additional] question is, did they have any relation to Ra the Sun God?

Well, they were very careful to explain they were not any relation to Ra the Sun God but that people understood the connection between Ra the God and the sun. They used the word Ra because that would spark – most people don’t know much about the stories of myth, but they’ve heard the Ra name and associate it with the Egyptians, and Ra did first appear to the Egyptians. They came from Venus which is associated in both Greek and Roman metaphysics with love and understanding. They took the name Ra but intended it only to indicate that their first appearance here for us was being called – the hunger and love for information – being called by a young pharaoh who had been named Amenhotep. Amen was a God of prosperity but Amenhotep rejected that name and changed his name to Akhenaton in stating there was only one God. So the message that all is one, and the beginnings of the Law of One, and the children of the Law of One began there. A different group of people also from Venus were called to Atlantis before Atlantis went under the waves for the last time. So there was a lot of offering of the Ra group to those two ancient civilizations and they discovered, in the case of those in Egypt… Don asks about this story and it goes into quite some detail that is very interesting as to how they created the pyramids, the way of initiation, the way of the initiated healer so that people could move into the pyramids, be healed and move out again – and how that was stolen as soon as Akhenaton died – and he died young. The priests became very politically corrupt and changed it so that it was only for the elite and the common folk had no way to get to the pyramids. There were, then, no longer initiated healers once Akhenaton died, because the priests were just waiting and biding their time to ruin this good thing. So the Law of One didn’t die, it went underground again. I think that our group was incredibly fortunate and probably favored to be the ones that brought this word through again for people to read if they want it, if it can be of use to them.

Nothing in the Ra Materials suggests you must believe this or that or you must feel this to be true. They just say to take a look and see what you think and if you like it, use it and if you don’t, move on and find something else.

We have to go to break again. You have a wonderful section on your web site entitled “Are you a Wanderer?” and I would think that half of my audience thinks they are wanderers. Let’s take that up when we come back.

[PROGRAM BREAK]

[END OF BREAK]

In the 1950s there was this man whose name I don’t remember, but he was in Southern California and he was referred to as “The Venusian”. I know he met with President Eisenhower and he brought all sorts of information from Venus to Earth, and then, when it looked like he was about to be arrested, for whatever the government was going to arrest him for, he vanished. Did the Ra group ever talk anything about him?

No, they did talk about the sort of thing that happened back in the 50s but I have to admit complete ignorance on that particular point. But also, as you know, back in the 50s there was a rumor that President Eisenhower was meeting with the extra-terrestrials and Don asked about that. Interestingly enough the Ra group said, well, yes, that had occurred and they offered to come openly among us and offer their philosophy for what it was worth, and Eisenhower felt that the shock would be too much for people, and he felt very protective about people of Earth. He said he thought that they just weren’t ready and, being very positively oriented and not wanting to infringe on free will, the Confederation of Planets in the service of Infinite Creator – a very weighty term – we just call it the Confederation for short, the Ra group said okay, we won’t, then, and that was it. And they never have. If you see some entity landing on the White House lawn, look out, it’s not positive, it’s a negative oriented entity or a bunch of entities. So they didn’t talk specifically about what you said, but yea, there was a very open attitude in the 50s compared to what there is now, and there was a ridicule lid that was squashed down on top of the whole UFO area. The ridicule lid was never penetrated really. J. Allen Hynek tried hard to bring scientific evidence to bear, he started feeding things to the – the called it the UFOcat – because when computers were really new they used it to compile reports and all these reports of physical traces, what he wanted because that was scientific evidence – they only listed cases where something landed, something happened, changes happened to the ground. You could see the ground glowing, you could measure differences, and they discovered that if, by the time they were collecting for a while, if they got a new report and the report said, okay, it was a triangular landing gear apparently, and measured thus by thus, they knew what the thing looked like before they heard the rest of the report. That’s how evidential it was. And so Hynek sent this astronomer guy and another 150 or so other astronomers [the UFOcat material] and he asked them, “Would you like to hear more about it?” And of course, they are scientists and open minded and said, “Well yes, we would like to hear more.” But it didn’t get out because of what Hynek called the ridicule lid. Nowadays you see little green men selling beer and being basically brought into pop culture as ridiculous, unreal people, much like farriers fairies and pixies, and the elves that make cookies. That doesn’t mean that they’re not real, that doesn’t mean that they’re not true, it just means that for the most part you’re looking at a bunch of hoaxes.

And the problem is the government. The minute the government knew that there were aliens, they started creating disinformation and so there is so much that we don’t know – we don’t even know if the Roswell crash really happened. I mean, that could be disinformation to hide the fact that the German technology was so far advanced beyond what we had at the time that it looked like it came from outer space. So we don’t even know what to believe.

They were taking things that they had found from various crashes and they were reverse-engineering them, bringing them in. Now you asked about the wanderers so I pulled up – if you don’t mind my changing the subject now?

Oh no, go right ahead.

Okay. I pulled up [Ra] Session 89 in which Don asked what was the reasoning for the wandering of the wanderers, and Ra says:

“All wanderers come to be of assistance in serving The Creator, each in its own way.”

And that’s all there is to it. Wanderers are those who come from elsewhere, they come through into the planetary influence of Earth by birth, they come into birth and they immediately, in common with all Earth people, they come into the veil of forgetting – they have to forget who they were so that in total free will they can take on the feeling of what it is they want to do right now, this incarnation, forget everything else, we are citizens of Earth, but – they come from elsewhere because their vibrations there have been somewhat more sophisticated and more positive and they’ve learned how to love each other more and they want to serve the people of planet Earth by bringing love to them. And of course it’s like coming into a boot camp or a survival camp or something like that for people whose usual vibration is like la-de-da-de-dah, things are nice, primroses and what shall I do next, I think I’ll be this or that. So they come into – I mean this is really hard for wanderers. They have to undergo the veil of forgetting and all of a sudden here they are, high-minded, optimistic, rosy, yes, I’m going to help Earth, I’m going to be wonderful, I’m going to make a difference – and then they wake up in the crib, wake up into childhood and things are not the way they remember them, and it doesn’t even feel like their home and so lots of people are saying, these are not my parents, I don’t come from around here, I don’t know what I’m doing here, I want to go home etc.

Well, these are wanderers and of course wanderers suffer from things like allergies because of Earth being of lower vibrations than what they’re used to and so their bodies start to break down under those vibrations, they suffer from a mental and emotional loneliness because there’s nobody that wants to talk about what they’re interested in talking about – which is why we have a bunch of private discussions going on in our bring4th.org forum for people who really want to talk to each other because they can’t find anybody in their family or home towns that – anybody close – that really they can speak with and be understood and have a good conversation.

It doesn’t matter whether or not they’re understood. They came here to lighten the consciousness of Planet Earth. You lighten the consciousness of Planet Earth just by getting out of the way. The energy of The Creator just is pouring through us all the time infinitely, and in infinite supply. There’s no end to this love and this light and it’s pouring through us and what we need to do is be able to empty ourselves of enough of our delightful ego and personality so the light can come shining through. It’s okay to have those personalities. It’s okay to be an individual. It’s fine to have different quirks and so forth because that colors the light just like a stained glass window would and it makes [the light] more beautiful.

But all of us can be lighthouses, and when lighthouses join together they can become ever brighter and ever more able to serve the light. So you find now that groups are starting to join together because it’s being recognized by everybody that we’re all in this together, we’re all in this in the last days of what the Ra group and all the Confederation calls the last days of third density going into fourth density. It lightens the light in the consciousness of Planet Earth.

I’m seeing that all over. I’m seeing the left and the right, hard-core progressives, and hard-core ultra-right wingers, I’m seeing them come together. And they realize that it’s the people that have to build community and we’ve got to let go of so much that we’ve been taught because we’ve been taught to hate. You know, the Republicans hate the Democrats, the union people hate non-union people, certain religions hate other religions, certain religious people hate anything that isn’t exactly what their minister’s belief system is – and I am seeing people dropping that. I’m seeing people realize that we’ve been fed a lot of lies not just from the churches and the governments, and the corporations, but from the schools that we went to. And so people are beginning to try to shed all of this c*** that is glued to them so that they can build communities with other like-minded people.

In my readings, I ask the questions – I say, “Now is this question going to matter in 10,000 years?” And that really is the cutting point. If it’s not going to matter in 10,000 years then probably it’s not a spiritually oriented question. I think there are more and more people realizing there’s that little world of Maya, that little world of illusion where all the bleeding, and the wars, the aggression and hatred – where all of these things that are errors in thinking occur, and then there’s another world right here in our hearts. And all we have to do to find it is to be quiet, to move into our hearts and ask – you know, “Knock and it shall be opened unto you.” 6

Do you believe that each one of us has the ability to create this world for us and around us?

I do. I think it’s closer to us than anybody could believe. It’s closer than our breathing.

Oh. It’s within us, within the very atoms that make up our body. Now how do you believe that we can get there? What do we have to do to get there?

I think that we’re so close that it’s a matter of encouraging people to sit in silence one way or another – not sit in silence, but BE in silence. People can be in silence as they enjoy nature – as they fish, as they are running. People can meditate and be there, they can be journaling and be there, they can be reading spiritually inspiring material and just take off on something that inspires them. The point is to get into your own heart.

And I think Christmas is so wonderful because every time we come to Christmas, and the baby Jesus is in the manger, I think to myself, “Oh, my spiritual self is the baby in that manger of my heart and I’m going to nurture that baby and I’m going to make a vibratory pattern of light for that baby, so that that spiritual being that is part of myself can grow up and know that it is loved so that it can thrive.”

So every Christmas I see this wonderful story happening all over again. I don’t mean that we’re all Jesus Christ, I mean that Jesus Christ dwells in all of us; [that we] are part of love because we’re all one in the vibration of love. And that oneness, you see – this is really neat – we have two minds, we have our intellects, and in our intellects and personalities we’re all completely individual, obviously. But we all have consciousness in common. And it’s that consciousness that comes to us in moments of silence. It’s consciousness that feeds us in dreams. It’s consciousness that we have in common, and it’s a consciousness of love. We are love. Every cell that is in our bodies was created by love, and the source of material that created the body from love is light. So there are different rotations [of light] .

Don, of course, asked all these questions of Ra as a physicist and got a much better picture of exactly how this works than I could ever express to you. But it just lays it out, blap, blap, blap, this is the deal, you are love, you are one. The trick is to wake up to that. And of course, when people do wake up to that, they are so excited: oh my heavens, it’s a whole new world! It’s a whole new world because it’s a whole new way of looking at things. I wrote a book to help wanderers do this. It was after 10 years of the Internet, so I was able to write all the people that had been writing their stories and say, “Well, could I have permission to share those?” And the people that gave me permission, about 200 of them, I used their quotes from our correspondence. And I also used quotes from the readings I had from the different Confederation sources. And I was also writing.

So A Wanderer’s Handbook is a combination of me writing, and the stories from the wanderers themselves, and the Confederation sources talking about the wanderer experience, how we can do it better. The book is called A Wanderer’s Handbook and it’s available free on-line for download, or if you’d like to buy the book – and of course, if you buy the book it helps us out – you can go to our [on-line] store and buy it, it’s a safe and secure store on (bring4th.org)[https://www.bring4th.org]. I think it might help people that feel they just don’t belong – they do belong, but they belong as wanderers. And it’s so comforting to finally find [that] out. I got a little package from Lacy Dalton about 10 years ago after she read the book for the first time and she said, “Well, here’s the song I wrote about us after reading your book” and it’s called “We Are the Wanderers” – [it’s] a beautiful, beautiful song.

Oh my gosh! I’m going to have to look it up on-line, I bet it’s on Youtube.

It probably is, yeah.

I am just putting up your two web sites in our talk stream live where people go to vote on talkstreamlive.com, so I have just put these up and for some reason it will not post. I have no idea why it will not post.

When you’re trying to do something positive, there is often resistance.

Anyway, I’ll get it up or you can go to rumormillnews.com and look for “Are you a Wanderer?” – that was the title of my post, and Carla’s web site will be in there. But let me give them out again, (llresearch.org)[/] and (bring4th.org)[https://www.bring4th.org]. I think that is such a great, great title, a great name for a web page. That’s what God put us here for. We’re all supposed to bring forth and people need to ask themselves, “What have I brought forth?” Is what you brought forth, what you came here to bring forth? Or is there something else God wants you to do? Have you finished your mission or have you not even started your mission? What do you think about that?

There are a lot of people that would say that if you think that you’ve got a mission in life, you’re probably neurotic. I would say, “Well, you know, it’s too bad about that because we do come – I think we come – [with a mission]. I think that just about all of us are wanderers at this point. It’s our last incarnation on Planet Earth, our last chance for [graduating]. And I think most of us are probably from elsewhere and we came here to do a job. And here we are up to our ankles in mud as far as the vibrations go. And what are we supposed to do? Well, we’re supposed to lift that by the way we live, and by the values we have and by how we respond at choice points.

Usually at a choice point, there’s a positive and loving thing to do, and there’s a fearful, defensive thing to do. If you can gut it out and be that person that you came to be, and make a positive choice – and there’s a positive space at that choice point – make a choice for love, make a choice for other people’s free will, supporting and encouraging others and encouraging and supporting the good in yourself, I think that you’ll soon find that rather than you’re being the poorer for supporting other people, that you’re getting bread on the water and people are thanking you again and again and again. I get thank you notes from all over the world every day. I tell you, it’s just wonderful to know that you’ve helped.

It is. I agree with that. I appreciate the thank you notes almost more than I appreciate the gifts that people give me so that I can keep the web site up and running. But I do appreciate the gifts.

Last winter we were just almost broke and we were supporting a lot of work. Don told me to make this happen and here we are and it’s happening and I said I feel like a little kid standing in the middle of a candy store and don’t have any money so what are we supposed to do? But we got enough [in donations] so that we can go on with everything, we just had to ask because people were glad to help, they wanted to be part of that labor of love that is Love and Light Research – our name is L and L Research [or L/L Research].

The reason we thought of that name, believe it or not, is scientific. At one point, Ra said that all was motion, that this is a world of motion or vibration which they called velocity. [Larson said that V = S / T or V = T / S, meaning Velocity equals Space over Time or Velocity equals Time over Space.] Well, it turns out that space is light and time is love. I might have gotten that backwards as I do sometimes when I’m talking, 7 but at any rate, love and light created all that there is. So you’re either in a time/space, or metaphysical world in the unseen realms, the inner realms, or you’re in a space/time world like we are [in the physical realm], in which all is illusion because the real things of us are not our bodies and so forth. It’s our thoughts that are real.

So when you’re trying to wake up, you have to focus on your thoughts. What were you thinking today? Were those thoughts the thoughts of love? If they weren’t, then you have to say, “Well, maybe next time I’ll be able to act differently.”

I remember my beloved uncle, who was just an astonishingly spiritualized man. At one point we were almost killed by a fool who was coming onto the expressway and trying to get us, from what we could tell! Uncle Marion jams on the breaks – hurting my shoulders and wrists, as I was in the back seat and didn’t have my seat belt on. And while he was doing this, he was saying, “There’s room for you too, buddy, there’s room for you too.” So you see, he could respond to a terrifying piece of catalyst in a loving way even while he was doing what he had to do to stay alive. He kept his mind in love, he never got mad, he never got road rage. I always try when that happens to me – when idiots are cutting me off on the expressway or whatever, I try to remember, “There’s room for you too, buddy.”

Interesting, interesting.

[It is] that willingness to love, that willingness to let love flow that opens the heart. And then you are vibrating in love. And there’s consciousness right there. It’s just so simple and so close and yet we do have to become silent, and this is not a silent generation, this is not a silent culture. Mostly we have the radio on, the television on, we’re in front of our computers. Usually we have our focus not on each other and not on ourselves. I love television, I watch it every day, I’m not saying, “Well, I never watch TV because I’m too good for that.” No sir, I’m an NCIS junky.

I am too. I love that program.

I don’t mistake that for spiritual work,. I do spiritual work too. I start the day by dedicating the day to the Creator, and I say, “Lord, it’s my intention to give this day to you so take me and use me as you will, take my voice, take my hands, take my heart, they’re yours.” I try really hard to stay there, but of course by 10:30 I’m usually really in a jangle and have to start working on tuning again because a lot of things happen to you after you get up. You can’t help what happens to you!

Oh my God, Carla, I’m going to have to interrupt you and go to break again.

[PROGRAM BREAK]

[END OF BREAK]

Carla, you must be doing something really, really good because you have ticked off religious people by calling yourself religious, and you’ve ticked off spiritual people by talking about these spiritual things. Isn’t that wonderful?

Share the wealth.

So if you can tick off both groups, you must be doing something good.

Oh, I hope so –

You’re pressing buttons, is what you’re doing.

And so are you! But that’s what we have to do, we have to penetrate the confusion and when people are ready for something else, they’re going to hear that.

The song that you play, The Moody Blues’ “One Step into the Light” – I seem to remember that there’s something there that I can use to talk to you about this very point. When you come to the end of that song it says, “Your dreams are not unfound. Get your feet back on the ground. The truth will set you free. We just have to choose.” 8 What do we have to choose? We choose the light or the dark. The prayer of St. Francis says it all: “Lord make me an instrument of your peace, let me serve love instead of hatred, let me serve union instead of disharmony, let me choose to love instead of to be loved, to comfort instead of to be comforted, and just let me be with you even though I die.” It’s just so simple, the prayer of St. Francis says it all. This is a very polarized world and it’s a world of choice.

Do we want to live in fear or do we want to live in love? If we want to live in love, we’re going to have to put away a lot of knee-jerk reactions that we’ve learned at Daddy’s knee. We have to let go of those great-ape feelings of beating our chest, defending the clan and everybody else out. We have to lose the idea that there’s somehow an elite and that we’re better than somebody else or somebody is better than we are. This is a completely universal world of democracy. We’re all equals spiritually because we’re all the same spiritually. We are all little bits of the Creator that He shot out from Himself to gather experience and to report back.

A lot of people have a very hard time accepting that truth. It’s like they are not good enough to be called a spark of the Creator –

And I don’t argue with that at all. I don’t think we are good enough in and of ourselves. I never say, well you know you’re going to be able to get to heaven by learning these things and then you’re going to be good. No. We’re all bozos on this bus, there’s no question about it. I make a thousand mistakes a day in my head. I try to keep them behind my teeth, as my mother used to say. We all make many, many mistakes, and that’s why I say the spiritual life is really a matter of letting go, and letting things flow through you instead of from you; asking to be a servant of the light, and then letting the light flow through you instead of trying to tell the light what to do.

It’s kind of hard to get it first but once you get the hang of it [you realize that] everything in nature is conspiring to talk to you. You’re thinking spiritually good thoughts and that’s going to help you. And all of a sudden on the radio here comes the song that underlines that. Or you’ll see a sign on a bill board that underlines it. It’s amazing the coincidences! Spiritual coincidences are amazing! And once you realize spirit is trying to talk to you, trying to help you, and you start paying attention to your moments, you start reading the street signs, and paying attention to the little things, you’re going to be seeing the animal that you’ve chosen to be your protector. You’ll be seeing signs all over the place. And you’ll realize the world is a very magical place that you’re dancing through. And as the Moody Blues said, “cosmic circles [are] ever turning” so we just have to join the dance – you know?

I like when they say “All the old things are returning, cosmic wheels ever turning.” 9 That was my theme song to my radio show back in 1986. Earlier, I was going to tell you that I interviewed one of Dr. Hynek’s assistants right after [Hynek] died. She was absolutely certain that he had been poisoned because two new people had come in, and they took him on a trip and when he came back he had – I guess he died of cancer – but you know, we’ve got this CIA cancer that is very easily given to people just in the hook of an umbrella or you swallow it in your dinner. I’m going to take the time and find that cassette and pray that it still works, because I think it’s time for that one to go on the web – it’s never been on the web, it’s just been in my box of recordings. I’ve never done anything with it.

Dr. Hynek was a very honest guy. He was a scientist. Don and I went to see him, I think it was in 1977. He was near Chicago and taught at Northwestern, as you know. He was a professor there, a very well respected guy. Now what would you think? You’d think he would be sitting there going, “Yeah, I know everything, so ask me a question.” No, he was asking Don questions, like, “Why do they do the things they do? How do they communicate? What’s the reasons they have telepathy instead of words like we have? And why do they use that?” I mean, that was interesting.

Four hours he kept us at his house, asking my most brilliant research partner questions, because Don had actually been in the field longer than he had as far as the paranormal goes. It’s a wonderful thing to see the respected people. When you get a person that is dedicated to looking only for the truth, they see the truth and it opens them up. But the problem is they can’t simply say, “Look, you’ve got to read this, you’ve got to understand this”, because of the government, the corporations, all the people that we always say are “they” and the ones in the matrix that are the developers of the matrix.

We are useful to corporations and to governments because of how we believe and what we buy. If we’re aren’t consuming, we’re not much use. So the whole pressure of TV and the media is on our becoming little consumers, so that our joy in life is going and getting the new thing. It supports all of the industries of the world. And that’s not a bad thing in and of itself. But when you start thinking, “That’s the real stuff, that’s the real thing, now I understand.” Well, you haven’t awakened yet. You’re still in the world of Maya, as Don and Buddhists say. It’s a world of illusion.

The Christian Scientists are about the closest thing we have in the Western world to an equivalency of what the Confederation message is. They too say that all is illusion and that’s why they feel that you can heal yourself or go to a Christian Science healer. The healer simply sits and knows the truth. And he is powerful enough at knowing the truth that he is able to share that knowledge with your cellular body and your body heals – and that’s the deal. I will never be there but I’m a teacher instead, not a healer.

We all have our gifts, and that’s the point. When people think, well what can I do? In the first place, the best thing you can do is be – a hard thing to understand, but we all have an essence. We’re all vibrating at a certain rate. And how we vibrate is a matter of what we’re thinking. So we think thoughts of love and service to other people. “What can I do for you? How can I support you? How can I support the cause of love? How can I make you feel better? Let’s have some fun!” All those are good things to think. You start freeing yourself from the prison of, “I’m so depressed. I don’t have the new thing yet.” It’s just a matter of stepping into the light, stepping into your own light because it’s free to all of us and we all can be light to each other. It’s amazing what we can do if we just remember to smile at people on the street. That smile might be the one honest, positive thing that’s happened that day for that person and it knocks them flat.

Isn’t that the absolute truth. Just going down the street smiling, and maybe even saying hello to people you don’t even know, “Hi! What a beautiful day it is today.” I grew up doing that, and then of course I had a few very difficult years in my life being married to the CIA and having death threats, not death threats but hit orders put out on me. 10

We had that too. 11 I always laugh at that and when our phones were tapped, we’d just sit there and I’d say “I’m really sorry, but whoever’s listening to this, my mother is going to call – this is my mother calling, you’re going to be so bored and I want to apologize to you ahead of time.”

Just like you, I used to talk to them. I had active listening taps on my telephone –

You know, there’s a way you can find that out, like it’s a proven thing, and you, too, could probably prove it. There was an inside tap and an outside tap and you could see whether your phone was tapped by calling this number and, sure enough, we were tapped both inside and outside.

I have even a better version than that, I called the telephone [company] because I was doing radio shows and I had a really fuzzy connection on the phone with lots of crackling and static and stuff like that. I called the phone man out and he went under the house and came back out and said, “Do you realize that your next door neighbor has tapped your line and is also using your telephone?” And of course I had no idea, but do you know that the neighbor packed his whole household up and moved by evening. He was gone, completely gone. I’ve never known anybody else who had a story quite like that one. But they didn’t give up on me, they still tapped me.

Oh yeah, they tried for a couple or three years. I think finally they decided after Don died that this sincere, but completely foolish, woman was not going to be a threat and just finally crossed me off the list.

I have wondered why I am allowed to continue the work I do with Rumor Mill. We have 50 million hits a month, and about a million and a half individual readers and so there’s an awful lot of information. So I’m wondering why in the world I am allowed to continue. The only thing I can think of is the government or the new world order or whoever is monitoring the pulse of the people by monitoring Rumor Mill News, because we truly are the pulse of the people worldwide. There aren’t very many other sites that are like mine because when you get chosen to be a reporter for Rumor Mill News, you don’t have an editor in front of you. You post any time of the day or night that you have written an article or found an article, and we don’t censor people unless they put up something pornographic or obscene or about private individuals, private citizens – just the basic common decency that keeps us from being sued – those type of rules. But there really isn’t another site around that is like Rumor Mill where we have 150 different voices talking to you every single day.

That’s a wonderful effort. Congratulations on it! I know that you’re making a tremendous difference helping people.

I hope so. It’s not that we’re not attacked. We’re attacked quite a bit by hackers. But we never really make a big deal of it for a couple of reasons: we don’t want the hackers to know what they are capable of doing to us, and it just doesn’t do us any good to say, “We were hacked, we were hacked!” We’d sound like the boy who cried wolf in many ways.

It’s so much better to turn away from all those specific things that are happening, not that they’re not happening, but that at this time is so important to be a voice of comfort, a voice of reassurance, a voice from a place that says, “Yes, things are changing and things are changing quickly – and they’re changing for the better. Wait and see.”

That’s what I also believe. While we’ve been on the air, I have had two emails come into me and one wants to know about the purported UFO attack – you know, we’re going to be invaded by the aliens. One wants to know what you think of that. And the other one that came in was, “Rockefeller says that 240,000 people are going to be killed at the 2012 Olympics in London.” Do you know anything about these things?

I know nothing about that. I know only that if somebody wanted to ask a question about that when I was doing a reading and they would say, “Well, give me some information”, we might get some information if they were not asking from fear. But usually people who ask questions about that are asking fear-based questions and I won’t accept them.

How does somebody get in your group, how does somebody join your group?

It’s just as easy as coming onto our web site and joining in a conversation on the forums on bring4th, or coming to see us when you’re in [Louisville]. We have meditation meetings that had to be suspended while I pulled through this time of healing, but when I get half-way better we’ll be having weekly sessions and I’ll be channeling again. All people have to do is call and say, “Listen do you have room for us?” We can only hold about 12 to 16 people so we have to limit the group. So call ahead and say, “We’d really like to come to town and meet you guys and be part of your meditation, and could you reserve a couple of places for us on this date.” My administrative person, Gary, will put you down and you’ll have a seat waiting for you when you get here. That’s about it. We don’t have formal “joinings”.

Where are you located?

Louisville, KY – sort of at the back of beyond! You just don’t get here unless you want to. It’s a very small town compared to big towns. It’s a wonderful place to live, actually. I don’t mean to be critical of it. It’s a wonderful food town, a wonderful arts town, it’s an old town compared to most places southwest of Pennsylvania. There were people settled here before us, the French that came down from Canada – the trappers had places here and of course there was a military presence called Corn Island by the British, who lived here in the 18th century when people with names like Daniel Boone settled in Kentucky.

If you want to get here, you have to fly in, and probably have to do a layover someplace like Atlanta first, or Indianapolis or Chicago. [It] doesn’t make any sense, but that’s the way it is. It’s just a matter of writing , and we’ll make it possible for you. I do counseling and channeling. I do charge for that because L/L Research needs money to pay its bills and so I make that my donation if I do any channeling for people. I’m not channeling for people yet because I’m still on pain medication, although I’m so accustomed to the pain medication that I’m able to be myself for the most part and make sense. I do not believe that it is wise to move into that very focused space where you do the work – and it is very focused work, channeling. And I would not disrespect it by trying to do it until I can get off the pain medication. And right now there is no question about it, because it’s one of those times when there is a lot of discomfort. I am doing counseling for people, although I don’t have any legitimate reason to call myself a spiritual counselor as I have no degrees in psychology or psychiatry. I always make that very clear. But the one thing I do that most people usually don’t is that I treat people as souls, I see everybody as a soul, and I try to help people see themselves that way.

A lot of times the challenges in life come from how you see yourself, and how you respect yourself, and how worthwhile you think you are. So I try to help people see how worthwhile they are, and how proud they can be of themselves and what a wonderful service they can render just by being themselves. I’ve had a lot of luck. A lot of people have thanked me for the work I do. But I would never say I’m ready to do this work because I have credentials, which I don’t, except for 45 years being in the field and helping people with their spiritual walk.

[PROGRAM BREAK]

[END OF BREAK]

Carla, do you remember where you were just before we went to break?

Yes, I do. 12 I was talking about how being a Christian has fed me throughout my life and that I realized two things: number one, it has fed me, and is right for me and number two, it does not feed a lot of people.

Thanks, Gary. Gary just came in with something for me to take with my 4:00 pain pill – these mundane things, gotta do them.

I have an abiding love of Jesus Christ. I am a church rat. Things being normal, I’m there when the church doors open. But my people, my seekers, the ones that find the work helpful that we’ve done, are usually those who have had religious difficulties in their childhood because of energies of judgment or guilt that were heaped upon them by the religious people with whom they were involved. Now I never had that, for one thing I think the Episcopalian Church, also called the Anglican Church worldwide but the Episcopalian Church in America, is unique. It doesn’t have the guilt of the Catholic Church, it doesn’t have the judgment of the Fundamentalist Church – it’s a civilized church, let’s put it that way. And it’s a heaven for mystics like me. When I first started channeling I went to my Bishop and my priest, and I asked them to read the stuff to see if I could continue in the church. They both read it and my Bishop said, “This looks fine to me,” and shook his finger at me and said, ”Just remember, if you continue in this ministry you are Christ to [the people who read and trust your channeling].”

So I’ve always tried to live as beautiful a life as I could so that the people would not be disappointed when they found out more details about my life. But it isn’t that I am Christ, in the way of being better than, it’s that I am Christ in the way of where this is the source where they found something to help. I have a very personal relationship with Jesus that is very real. When I was a little girl, I was very odd. When I was supposed to take a nap I had a habit of putting my glasses, which I always had because then I was so cross-eyed, on those heavy slats of venetian blinds that we used to have. We don’t have them much anymore, they are now thinner and sometimes they are vertical slats, but we had the old fashioned venetian blinds and I would put the glasses there. One day, when I was not taking my nap, I was lying there on the bed looking out the window and I saw that the light had collected into a point of intense light in my glasses, and somehow I floated out on that beam of light and entered a magic forest and it was wonderful.

All the trees could talk to me, and the animals could speak to me and there was a fellow there named Jesus. He never said a word. He had golden eyes, he was not a pretty man, and he was dusty from the road. He had golden eyes and He would look into my eyes and I would know what love was. That was enough for me, that was it. I adored that awareness that was Jesus. I loved to hold His hand and be in my magic forest. I did that for probably a couple of years when I was little, and then I made the mistake of telling my parents about it and they said that was impossible and, of course, then I couldn’t do it anymore.

But I never disrespected the memory of what had happened. Mother said she never had to talk about Jesus [to me], but I was talking about Jesus to her as a toddler. So Jesus is so real to me. I adore Jesus and have no interest in dogma, I just lost all the Christians that are listening “What’s this?” But there is no question about how much I adore Jesus. So I can’t do dogma.

And again I was talking to this same Bishop, a very wise old man, when I was 13 or 14. I was at church camp and he was holding an Inquirer’s Class for anybody that wanted to ask [questions about our church and its faith]. I was the only one there, nobody was inquiring but me. Everybody else was out dancing and why not – I was so out of it that I wanted to ask him questions.

I said that I think maybe I should become a Jew or something because I believe in Jesus. But I don’t believe in the virgin birth. He shook his head and said, “You know, I’ve had trouble with that myself.” Well, my heart just stopped and I dropped my jaw and said, “How do you say the Creed?” and he said, “I say the Creed in hope that one day, probably not while I’m in this lifetime, probably after I die, I will understand. But I do not, it is a total mystery. I say it in faith. Don’t worry about it. It’s part of our faith. Just say those words that are so sacred and don’t worry about anything except loving the Lord, and being of service to other people, like Jesus said, to love the Lord your God with all your heart, your mind, your soul, your strength, and love your neighbors as yourself. This contains all of the law, all of the prophets, the Old Testament, in other words, and it’s all you need to go on with.” I always remembered that he shook his hand at me and said, “Don’t you leave the church. You’ll have nobody to talk with Jesus about if you leave the church.” He was right.

Isn’t that the truth!

Yes. I’m a member of the choir and I’m there every Sunday and it feeds me. It really feeds me. When I started the Ra contact, the Ra group asked Don and Jim to create an altar and put a cross on the altar, and all of the accoutrements – the cup, the incense and the Bible open to The Gospel according to John, the First Chapter – they said that was the closest to the Law of One that was in the Bible that vibrates with cohesion for them. They didn’t make me take my little gold cross off even though they said that they came in on such a narrow beam that any metal in the room would mess up the signal. But they said, “No, not Carla’s cross, she needs the cross. She needs these things to comfort her.” And they had no trouble. They called this a distortion and they didn’t see any harm in it.

That is amazing. Carla, I have to tell you that we’ve got two things in common. One, I’m also an Episcopalian – that’s the church I choose to go to and they are one of the most accepting churches that I’ve ever run across. And second, I have had a relationship with Jesus since the moment I was born.

That’s beautiful.

I can remember Him walking by my side and my talking to Him. I grew up in the country, in the forest – definitely not in the city. So I was out in the wild a lot when I was a child. My parents allowed me to grow up wild. I grew up wild, is what I did. Jesus was there with me the entire time. I can remember talking to Him and asking Him questions and getting answers.

One time my grandfather, whom I loved more than anything in the world at that time, had a car fall on him and I didn’t know whether he was going to live or die. So at 3 years old I climbed to the tip-top peak of our barn, because I thought God and Jesus were going to be closer there for me, and I just prayed and prayed and prayed. And finally Jesus said, “You don’t have to worry about him. He promised he was going to stay with you until you were grown. Don’t worry.” He did not die until he was 90 and I was 30 years old at the time. I could still barely accept it but it was a lot better than if he had died when I was 3 years old which is when that happened.

Isn’t that wonderful, it completely takes the question off the table of, “Do you believe in Jesus Christ?” Well, why not. Do you believe in your uncle? Your neighbor? You talked to Him, you walked with Him. So why wouldn’t you believe in Him? And when people say, “Do you believe that He ascended into heaven?” I don’t care. What I care about is the look on His face that said, “I love you so much I would die for you.”

That’s correct, and he said that to every single human on Earth. Not just the Christians or the Jews but every single human on Earth, and everyone that would be born on Earth. So it doesn’t matter who He was or how He came or went. What he gave us is just the most comforting information that any of us can have. It’s not that I believe the entire Bible. I’m still one of these people where nobody has yet been able to make me believe that Paul was not the first infiltrator. Peter hated women and so how can I trust anything Paul or Peter said?

And why did they throw out the book of Mary Magdalene and the book of Thomas, and the book called Jesus Infant One and Infant Two? Why did the Romans keep those out of the Bible? Infant One and Infant Two, in my mind, absolutely tell me that Jesus came into this world as a powerful, gifted – for want of another word – sorcerer. He was a child with the power of a sorcerer and he did things that were not always good. I think he blinded one of the rabbis when the rabbi told Him that he shouldn’t be making clay birds by the side of the river on the Sabbath. And so He got mad and told the birds to fly off and I think the rabbi was the one that was blinded.

But the one story, that I think is just fabulous, is when one of His friends fell off a roof and died. The parents came to Joseph and said, “Jesus killed our son.” And Jesus said, “I didn’t kill your son. Here, let me bring him back to life, and he’ll tell you I didn’t kill him.” So He brought the boy back to life and the boy told his parents, “No, no, Jesus didn’t have anything to do with my death.”

I can’t remember if he let the boy live or if he just let the boy die again. But isn’t that a more believable story? A young child being born on Earth with these incredible gifts and powers – and he had not developed wisdom yet. And He went to India – at least according to all the history books that I’ve read – and I believe it was in India where he learned wisdom. And I also learned that he had to come back to fulfill the covenant that had been made by His blood ancestors with God. And that covenant required that He die on the cross and be resurrected. Do you believe that, too?

Yes, I do. The question of whether he went to India or not is moot. Nobody can prove it one way or the other. But that’s typical. He is an historical figure. Here’s what’s Ra said about Jesus:

“The one known to you as Jesus of Nazareth did not have a name. [The Ra group said] He was a member of the highest level of fifth density.” In the way the Confederation organizes things – we’re in 3rd density, the density of choice. The next density, 4th, is of love and understanding. The next density after that is the density of wisdom. The Ra group continues: “This entity was desirous of entering this planetary sphere in order to share the love vibration in as pure a manner as possible. Thus this entity received permission to perform its mission. This entity was then a wanderer of Confederation origin, representing fifth density vibration understanding or love.” And then the Ra group says, “He was fourth density graduating into 5th.” That makes a lot more sense. They said they always had trouble with numbering.

Basically the spiritual point here is that people’s lives tell their own story. “By their fruits you shall know them.” 13 Jesus’ life and His death expressed a total loyalty to doing what the Father asked of Him, regardless of what it cost Him.

And of course he said, “Hey, do I really have to do this? Couldn’t this cup pass from my lips? But if not, so be it.” 14 And He went through it very gladly and knew that, as you said, this was part of the mission that he came to Earth to do. We all have that same choice to make. Would we like our lives to express the vibration of love – the life itself, as we live it moment to moment, as we clean the toilet, and as we wash the dishes, as we do all those chores that people have decided have no spirituality? Jesus said everything is spiritual. Jesus was there to prove it. All things that you do are spiritual, and can be spiritualized. One thing I have learned in my marriage to Jim McCarty, who is a remarkable man, is that if you can work with a partner to create a life in balance, and in understanding, then all of those things that you would think of as mind-numbing chores become spiritualized and you can do them in great love and offer them to the Creator with all of your heart.

My husband mows lawns for a living. 15 He owns a lawn service and he’s out there on his mower. I always think of him as a great knight, a knight in shining armor that is going forth on his orange steed, and he’s making [Anchorage’s] acreage beautiful for all of us. We have about 4 houses on our street and only about 10 houses around here that you can holler at and somebody can hear you, and all of those people hire Jim. I always tell him that his job is to keep the acreage beautiful. It’s like our little village. He knows that somebody has got to pay the bills so he goes out there and dedicates his life to mowing the lawns and taking care of the mulch, the leafs in the drains and all of that stuff and he dedicates it to The Creator.

He’s doing just exactly as good a job of it as I get to [do] stay[ing] home and supporting him, [in his] work with people by encouraging him, [while I] do my writing and so forth. It’s really important to realize that, no matter what you’re doing, it can be spiritualized if you just let it be. If you just dedicate your day to service and to the Creator, that is going to open up to you so many chances to be of service! And then all you need to do as moments of the day go by is notice when those moments come, and give that smile to somebody on the street, or do more than just buy something at the grocery store – look at the person that’s checking you out. That’s a soul too; that’s you! Give that person the honor and respect to say, “Hey, how are you? How are you doing today?” You learn if you start talking to people. You learn about their families – and we’re all one big family, . The more of that you do, the more you start generating love. : “Oh, I’m so glad that this happened for you or your child.” And the more you know, the more you can do that. Your day becomes a beautiful thing, and all you’ve done is gone to the grocery or something.

Yeah, you become family. You become community. And all it takes is being in the same cashier’s line a few times and getting to know that cashier. It’s amazing the difference that the whole attitude in the grocery store takes on for you after you’ve become friends with a few of the cashiers and you can go in and they recognize you, and you can say hi. It is amazing. At least I find it amazing.

Carla, I want to talk to you about one of the groups that you channel, and it’s the group called Q’uo. Am I pronouncing it right?

Yes. [She said Koo-oh.]

The one session that I bring up is the one on April 12, 2008 – I’m sure you don’t remember it but in this one, the speaker for Q’uo was Hatton rather than Latwii.

Whenever my friend, Roman, wants to have Q’uo speak, he always asks for Hatton because when he first came, before the Q’uo contact, he was listening to Hatton a lot, and he liked [their energy].

What year was this?

The Ra contact began in 1980 and ended in 1984, and soon afterwards I received… when I said, “Who goes there, who wishes to speak in the name of Jesus the Christ?” I got the name, “Q’uo.” I said, “Okay, who are you? And what they said was because of the way I tuned – I ask for the highest contact that I can carry in a stable and conscious manner of the vibration of love of Jesus the Christ – the Ra group knew that they could not speak with me consciously and promised they would never do that because it would tear me up. I was down to 80 pounds doing the trance work and all I wanted to do was that next session, because I loved to see Don so happy and not so melancholic.

At any rate, I knew that I couldn’t channel Ra, and Ra knew that too. So this was a solution. They got together and they answered my call for the highest and best that I could carry consciously. The Ra group was in it and that was sixth density, the Density of Unity. Then there was the fifth-density contact that was my favorite contact before those of Ra, and that was Latwii, who has a wonderful sense of humor, and that showed through in the Q’uo writings. And [there was] fourth-density Hatton there because of the quality of love – and the three moved together to consider any questions that we had, and then Latwii would voice the answer for the three of them. Well, silly me, I took them at face value, didn’t think to ask who might this group be consisting of and finally, I guess about 2 or 3 years later, I finally asked the question: exactly who are you and they said, this is who we are and that’s why we named ourselves Q’uo – because in Latin it means “who”, among other things. I was so dumb I didn’t get it – like duh! You’d think I would as I had 3 years of Latin but no, I just wasn’t creative enough to see it. But that’s who that was and it’s really a contact that was designed specifically for me. So if you see somebody else who say they channel Q’uo, it’s unlikely they are channeling the same entity.

That was exactly what I wanted to bring up. The original Hatton was channeled in the early 1950s, and he seemed to be a Hatton of love. But then there was the Hatton that was channeled by Doris Ekker, starting about 1986 or 1987, somewhere around there. That was a Hatton of power and rage and anger.

Here’s what happened, the Confederation channeling in Detroit was started by a fellow named Walt Rogers, and another fellow whose name I don’t recall. Walt showed Don Elkins some of his Hatton information that was the love information. And it was suggested in that information that, in order to begin to get your own channel messages, all you had to do was meditate together.

[PROGRAM BREAK]

[END OF BREAK]

I know of three separate Hattons, one in the 1950’s, one that Carla was channeling in the early 1980’s, and then the one that Doris Ekker [and others] took over sometime around 1986 or 1987. Can you continue where you were on this before the break?

Yes, here’s what happened: you may recall I said earlier that the way you vibrate personally is what you draw to yourself. You can channel the spirit version of how you’re vibrating. So if you change your vibration by praying, by chanting or meditating – by whatever way it is that helps you arrive to an open-hearted, focused level, then you are getting to a higher vibration. You’re able to channel a more positive source.

And if you start taking fear-based questions, if you start taking specific questions, then you start de-tuning and naturally a negatively oriented individual from the inner planes is perfectly capable of mimicking the way a positive vibration source feels – because they wouldn’t have graduated into that density if they didn’t know how to use the light. Your use of inner planes is all about, “Can you use that light?”

So in Detroit what happened was they had a beautiful group going which was called Man, Consciousness, and Understanding, and they mostly had Hatton, but there were other entities and everything eventually became fear-based. There was a lot of right-wing fear there. People were being told to stock up – you see this in every decade. I’ve been around for a while and you see this in every decade, it just reinvents itself. Things are coming to an end, store freeze-dried food so that you can survive it, be afraid, be very afraid! And the group believed that.

There was enough of a contest in the group in Detroit that a part of the group took off for the West in fear – like you just aren’t up with what’s happening now, and so they were asking nothing but fear-based questions. So Hatton becomes Lord and Master Hatton or something like that, and you get a very militaristic, glorified [channel]. Everybody’s got a title. Everybody’s got a echelon and there’s the elite. So here we go to negative. And of course the negative can sound a lot like the positive until they say, “Be afraid, be very afraid.”

The way that you read channeling is: if you feel, at the end of that channeling session, expanded, hopeful, full of light, just lifted up, then you’ve listened to a positive channel. If, on the other hand, you’re starting to think about finding a place in the country, and buying some freeze-dried food, you’re not listening to a positive channel. You’re listening to a fear-based channel in which the channeler – through no fault of his own – there’s not much written about this and I may be the only one who’s ever written about this and I’m just a little tea cup of a person, 16 not important at all, not well known. So they don’t know any better and they’re getting worse and worse and worse, and it’s getting scarier and more fear-based. And it’s just impossible to pull it back after a certain time. You see this happening with group after group after group. It starts out with the most positive, beautiful message. And then somebody starts asking specific questions about the future, usually fear-based and the person’s ego comes into play here. A channel that doesn’t want to say, “I don’t know,” is really a good candidate for becoming a fear-based channel. You have to be fearless and let the channel, let the source, say, “I don’t know, I don’t know about that.” You have to be okay with that.

There are a lot of things Ra talked about [concerning] what’s going to happen in the future and they said it’s a case of possibility/probability vortices. Until something happens, it hasn’t happened and it’s not real. But you can see the vortex forming towards something happening, and they can see the energies that are likely for something to happen. So the likely strongest possibility/probability vortex is the one that will probably happen. But they don’t say something will happen before it actually occurs. They never accepted questions about what was going to happen in the future and would say, “We don’t know, because it’s not happened yet, and you can change what happens by the way you think.”

So our position here is, don’t condemn the people that were trying to serve and got de-tuned and didn’t know it and so they’re putting out difficult [negative] material. I never bad mouth another channel no matter what I think. I won’t tell people what I think. I tell them, “You have every power in the world. You have discrimination. You know what’s for you. The way you feel inside will tell you what’s for you. Seek what feels right for you and, if it doesn’t feel right to you, move on.” [It’s as] simple as that.

That way people can make the decision themselves. People sometimes really want to be told, “This is good, this is bad,” and that’s how Fundamentalist Churches are born. They want to know what’s going to happen, how things are going to be and how they should act. They want it to be a black and white world in which they know all the answers. So in order for that to be, then, they have to listen to one source who loves to give you all the answers. And they could be true or they could be false. But it’s one person’s view and bound to be skewed. And it’s certainly not the view of the man called Jesus, who wouldn’t even give you a straight answer. He told stories and parables, some of which remain puzzling.

So you just have to decide for yourself if that channeled source is for you. And don’t be discouraged because you see a source that sounds pretty negative. Just move on. That source just might help somebody. You don’t know. I’m certainly not in any position to judge anything else.

I wanted to read to you before we leave about Ra’s view of life. The session question asked was, “Why must we come into an incarnation and lose conscious memory of what want to do, and then act in a way in which we hope to act?” It’s like, why do we have to forget and then re-learn it. And Ra says:

“Let us give the example of the man who sees all the poker hands. He then knows the game. It is but child’s play to gamble, for it is no risk. The other hands are known. The possibilities are known and the hand will be played correctly but with no interest. In time/space and in the true-color green density, the hands of all are open to the eye. The thoughts, the feelings, the troubles, all these may be seen [this is the next density up]. There is no deception and no desire for deception. Thus much may be accomplished in harmony but the mind/body/spirit [that’s a person] gains little polarity from this interaction. Let us re-examine this metaphor and multiply it into the longest poker game you can imagine, a lifetime. The cards are love, dislike, limitation, unhappiness, pleasure etc. They are dealt and re-dealt and re-dealt continuously. You may, during this incarnation begin — and we stress begin — to know your own cards. You may begin to find the love within you. You may begin to balance your pleasure, your limitations etc. However, your only indication of other-selves’ cards is to look into the eyes. You cannot remember your hand, their hands, perhaps even the rules of this game. This game can only be won by those who lose their cards in the melting influence of love; can only be won by those who lay their pleasures, their limitations, their all upon the table face up and say inwardly, ‘All, all of you players, each other-self, whatever your hand, I love you.’ This is the game: to know, to accept, to forgive, to balance, and to open the self in love. This cannot be done without the forgetting, for it would carry no weight in the life of the mind/body/spirit beingness totality.”

Now to me, that helps a lot to explain why we have to suffer. We suffer to receive the catalyst that we need to come to a choice point where we choose love. And once we choose love, the game opens up and we find, no matter what our situation, we can be helpful to other people in service to others. And this is the game – to open the self in love. May we all do that every day. I love you, Rayelan.

[no response from Rayelan].

Are you there? Well, that’s interesting, either I’m on the radio and she’s not, or she’s on the radio and I’m not.

Humm. I’m afraid the positive channeling may have blown the circuitry. This happens all the time. Rayelan, are you there?

Well, since I don’t know how to call into them, perhaps what I should do, folks, is hang up and let them call me again. I think that’s about the best thing I can do right now. So that’s what I’m going to do, so God bless everybody, if I’m on the air, and I’m going to hang up so they can find me again.

[A FEW MINUTES LATER]

Hello Carla, are you there?

I am there. Something happened, my phone just went dead while I was talking.

And I was talking and gave an entire lecture on the Commander Hatton that Doris Ekker channeled and nobody heard me.

That’s too bad, that’s a waste of time, isn’t it? You know, there is a lot of resistance when you get into positive information. I have technical problems all the time. The energy just blows the system.

Boy, that has happened to me more times than you can imagine. But we’ve got just about enough time for you to give out your contact information, and if there was anything you wanted to finish up on your [discussion of the two] Hattons, we can finish that up too.

No, I would just say that the Hatton that I’m aware of is a beautiful creature. He is an entity of total love, and if you go onto our site, www.llresearch.org which is our archive library site, and use the site search feature and type in “Hatton”, you’ll be able to see all of Hatton’s messages. And of course all of Quo’s messages have Hatton as a very important part of that message.

The other thing that you might want to do if you’re feeling alienated or isolated or just frustrated because you can’t find somebody to talk to about things that are interesting to you spiritually, is to get on to www.bring4th.org and see if any of the conversations in the many forums might be of interest to you because there are ongoing conversations on all kinds of things.

I took a look at some of them, and I love them.

We make sure that it’s all in love.

I’ve got a question for you right out of the blue – a news headline today is, nobody knows where dogs came from. Has anybody ever told you where dogs came from?

No, nobody’s told me where dogs come from, but one thing that we have been told is that you can invest your dog with love to the point where the next time they become incarnated they become your little boy or your little girl.

Oh my God, I have heard that very same thing, too. And you know, most people don’t like the fact that a dog or a cat can become human but I truly believe they can. And I think one of my little dogs was a black magician in the last life, and he came back to me so that I would love him enough that he would overcome that side of his nature.

That’s the great healer. The great healer is love.

Yeah, the great healer is love.

Thank you so much for having me.

You are very, very welcome. And I just wanted to give out your other site which is www.llresearch.org, L/L stands for love/light research dot org – I love that. And folks, this is Carla Rueckert and she is the one that brought through so many, many years ago The Law of One. Whether you believe in channeled information or not, The Law of One is worth reading – it really is worth reading. And you said you can download it for free from the site or you can buy it off Amazon or buy it from your site. Is that correct?

That’s right, it’s a little bit handier to buy it, but if you don’t have any money you can download each session as you read it.

That’s very good, because it’s amazing how many people have very little money at this time.

Especially the spiritual among us – the spiritual among us are poor.

I wonder if it’s because we were programmed to be poor so that we couldn’t interfere in what the elite do.

Well, that’s possible, I don’t know.

Well Carla, it’s been delightful and these three hours went by so quickly! I wonder what we were getting into at that particular moment when they took us both off the air. They took you off first, and the moment I started to do my lecture on Doris Ekker’s Hatton they took me off. Evidently, somebody that was listening to us doesn’t want the world to know that the CIA uses voice to make channels – they make channels. They didn’t have it back when you started though.

Well, they did. Don and Andrija [Henry] Puharich were doing research into that and of course [Puharich] was hounded all the way down to Mexico when he started to try to make some of this public, and was ultimately killed by the CIA. Yes, that all happened. It’s very sad. And we lost the wonderful notes that we’ll never be able to find again because the CIA went into his home and simply took them.

We’ll have to get you back on again and talk about some things like that. So thank you very much for being my guest here on radio RMN. Thanks for listening.

[END OF INTERVIEW]

  1. Carla’s note: This editing process has been interesting. Firstly, I edited roughly the first half of this article. Then I got busy with other things and time passed. Secondly, one day I tried to open this manuscript to continue my edit, and it had turned into something completely different, a one-page entry in a daily blog I keep with my husband, Jim McCarty. A lot of my work had been lost. Now, thirdly, as I try to discover the date of this interview, or any address for reaching Allan, or any archive of this show, my computer informs me that those links no longer work. So I would not know even the exact date of this interview, were it not for my calendar, which tells me it was at 2:00 p.m. on May 27th. Given the rest of my unusual experiences, this is amazing and disquieting. ↩

  2. Wikipedia says this about Ra: “As the cult of Amun grew in importance, Amun became identified with the chief deity who was worshipped in other areas during that period, the sun god Ra. This identification led to another merger of identities, with Amun becoming Amun-Ra. In the Hymn to Amun-Ra he is described as “Lord of truth, father of the gods, maker of men, creator of all animals, Lord of things that are, creator of the staff of life..’” So Carla’s memory was shaky, but not altogether wrong. ↩

  3. From Session One of The Ra Material: published by Schifffer Pubishing, Atglen, PA, 1983. ↩

  4. Between 1861 and 1935, various Indian holy men, notably Paramahansa Yogananda, reported meeting so-called Babaji, meaning “great avatar”, and feeling he was their guru. This is still happening. ↩

  5. Carla’s note: This footnote just records a great deal of information lost on this subject. I had a complete history of this fascinating “church of Thomas” from Rayelan, but it disappeared, as has Rayelan. ↩

  6. Carla’s note: That is a quotation from the Bible. Jesus says, in Matthew 7: 7-8, “Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: for every one that asketh, receiveth; and he that seeketh, findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.” It’s a good system which we, all too often, forget to use! ↩

  7. Carla’s note: Sadly, I did get that backwards. Space is love; time is light. So the physical world is S/T or space/time, while the metaphysical or unseen realms are T/S, or time/space.. ↩

  8. The sixth and last verse of this song is, “There’s one thing I can do, play my Mellotron for you, Try to blow away your city blues. Your dreams are not unfound, get your feet back on the ground. The truth will set us free. We cannot lose, we cannot lose! We cannot lose, we just have to choose!” Since this is called the Density of Choice by Ra and the Confederation in general, this is a very apt lyric for our time. This song is part of their ninth album, Octave. It was published in 2009. ↩

  9. These lyrics are also part of the song, “One Step into the Light”. ↩

  10. This is an amazing story. RumorMillNews.con says this: “Gunther and Rayelan Allan Russbacher Founded Rumor Mill News in 1996 as a Print Magazine. After Gunther disappeared, in December of 1996, Rayelan discontinued it as a magazine. She started Rumor Mill News again in 1998 as an internet newsletter. In 1999 she launched it as a webpage. It has become one of the Internet’s most popular webpages.

    Gunther Russbacher was a CIA operative. Rayelan was a lecturer and investigator who worked with Barbara Honegger, the author of the first book on the October Surprise scandal. When Gunther and Rayelan married in 1989, the Bush Administration panicked. As a result, Gunther became the most famous political prisoner of the George H.W. Bush administration. Russbacher was the pilot who flew Bush back from the negotiations in Paris that finalized the October Surprise. Rayelan was an investigator who was working to expose the October Surprise!” For more, read more on http://www.rumormillnews.com. ↩

  11. Carla’s note: That is a huge exaggeration. We had no death threats! Just a lot of annoying phone taps. In my ignorance of her incredible trials, I over-stated our degree of involvement in the CIA. Our presence would never have become known to the CIA except for our work with Andrija Puharich, who did indeed have death threats from the government secret services. ↩

  12. Carla’s note: We must have talked about this during the break! Obviously, we were not talking about that when the break began. I apologize for the apparently incorrect response! ↩

  13. In context, this Biblical quote from Matthew 7: 15-20 reads, “Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” ↩

  14. In context, the passage in Matthew 26: 37-45 reads, “And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy. Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death: tarry ye here, and watch with me. And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt. And he cometh unto the disciples, and findeth them asleep, and saith unto Peter, What, could ye not watch with me one hour? Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak. He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done. And he came and found them asleep again: for their eyes were heavy. And he left them, and went away again, and prayed the third time, saying the same words. Then cometh he to his disciples, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.” And that was the beginning of the final drama of Jesus’ life. ↩

  15. Carla’s note: I am happy to say this is old information. Jim retired from lawn service work in January 2013. He now works full-time for L/L Research. ↩

  16. Carla’s note: I love that phrase, but I did not create it – I heard Chris Rock say it in a comic program. He is a fine comic! ↩